First Date DC

Games are bad. If a woman pulls any of that shit from “The Rules” then dump her. Don’t hesitate, don’t think twice. Dump her.
There is playing games and there’s playing it cool.
Requiring that since you called last time she must call this time is a game.
While still pitching woo, calling more than once a day is creepy eager and not cool.

Really, the difference between hard to get, too strong, and not strong enough depend on the woman. Yes, you DO need to be a mind reader. A woman coming out of a long, bad relationship may find calling more than once a week heavy pressure. Another woman may think you’re not interested if there’s not a message from you on her answering machine when she gets home from your date. A woman who reads too many romance novels may think you’re not interested if you don’t sweep her up in your manly arms and carry her off to your draped four poster bed. An uber-christian may find your attempt to shake hands too forward.

If there were rules that could be written down they would automatically change.

You are man and you are screwed.

How about a list of definate do-nots. Can we get one of those for him?

Often when you have rules for yourself they just cause you to make the same mistake over and over again. As for girls playing games, its inexcapable, and unless your interested in ugly girls your going to have to figure out the game or resign yourself to only getting laid on the occasions that you accidently do the right thing. Experience is the best thing for your game, the worst thing is listening to advice from people who don’t know (and most guys have no clue).

Yeah I hate the game, and I probably suck ass at it. I think Kathryn’s right on with this one.

I admit the “game” does suck, however I do believe that it is quite necessary at the start. Both females and males enjoy a challenge and being intrigued. Feelings of wonder and a bit of doubt are very powerful. We sort of hate it but we kind of enjoy it too. If we are interested in you then a bit of suspense is good. We all tend to be attracted to people who appear confident, self assured and who have other things going on in their lives besides “pursuing” us. Calling once a day or every second day is ok. But multiple calls for no specific reason, to just yak, or just “to hear” her voice is not to desirable. If you call and leave a message then let her return your call. Don’t call back because you haven’t heard from her. Unfortunately it will be construed as overeagerness and although her ego will enjoy it…. I doubt it will make her like you more. By the same token, demonstrating complete aloofness, or indifference and behaving like an unemotional jackass is very poor tactic unless you want to attract someone who has poor self esteem.

The answer to your question is that it Depends on each individual you come across. As a female, if you want to avoid falling in the “friend” zone with me then asking for my number would be a great start. When you do call, set up a date with me. When we do go out on our first date, I don’t want to hear about your Exes, childhood scars and your emotional baggage, nor do I want to hear about your hangups. Be Positive. Don’t pour your heart out to me. I won’t be interested in that. If the date goes well and you want to see me again, call me in a few days and ask me out on another date. Take it slow.

I’m sticking with my original answer. Games are bad. They indicate the person is more interested in the power struggle and gaining the upper hand than the person they’re wooing.
Far too many of the questions that come up on this blog are the result of games going horribly wrong. Really, there’s no way for the games to go right.

It’s just the way the human brain works. You want what you can’t have, you want what everyone else has, you want what is hard to obtain.

No matter what your income or status, there is something in life you can’t have and you want it. Dating works the same way as cars, power, and money.

As stupid as it sounds, people base value on obtainability (if that is a word)

If you are always there for the taking, you aren’t worth much. Do you really need a 5K square foot home? No — but you like them because they are hard to obtain.

Play it cool. Act like you have something to do and a live a life.. Don’t call all time, be decisive, and act mature.

It beats 80% of the people out there.

Tampa

On man, how many hours have I spent debating this issue with fellow wings and even DCB himself? How much interest to show during the pick up, how soon to call, whether to call again if she does not return a call…it can all make your head spin. Given the wide variety of girls and the random ways girls can rule you out (see Sally’s recent post on “deal breakers” on DCB), there is no one method that works best with all girls.

In the end, I settled on a couple of principles to guide me. The first is “play the game to win, don’t play not to lose.” That means, when in doubt, go for it. Make a strong valiant effort, and if it does not work, you can feel satisfied that you did your best and it was not meant to be. Nothing worse than not calling or not showing interet out of some defensive fear that she may stop liking you because you are “no longer a challenge,” and have her decide you are just too wimpy.

The second principle is “not too serious too soon.” So while I do indeed go for things, it is very important not to show too much interest too soon. Yes, it’s ok to be interested, but it’s “I want to get to know you better” interest, not “oh my god you’re the one for me” after the 3rd date. I have found both personally and with wings that making her think you are too serious too soon is the absolute kiss of death from which it is impossible to recover.

Back when I was dating, I heard a gazillion stories from my encoupled girlfriends saying: we didn’t start out slow! We talked for FOUR HOURS during our first phone conversation. Our first date lasted an ENTIRE WEEK. And so on.

On the other hand, there was every dating advice book known to man, saying both to women and to men: “Keep it casual to start with. Play it cool. Don’t rush into things, blah blah blah.” Plus there were all my “Rules Girl” single girlfriends, saying: “The man should do all the work. Men like to pursue. If you call him back, he’ll devalue you in his mind and in the unlikely event that you manage to have a relationship, it will be worthless because he’ll never respect you. And don’t sleep with him for at least 6 months! And if he doesn’t pursue you agressively and do all the work, he’s just not that into you … NEXT.”

I tried being “normal,” i.e. pursing guys I liked. Didn’t work and led to humiliating rejections. I tried The Rules. Didn’t work for me. I tried the dating advice books. Didn’t work for me. I was single and miserable, albeit dating constantly, for 4 horrible years.

Then, I met my now-fiance. It was my idea to meet. He didn’t play it cool, but showed right away that he liked me a lot. I didn’t play it cool either. We didn’t really follow any of the rules. And before you knew it, we were in love and engaged and living together and embarrassingly happy as only two smug engaged people can be.

So, I suggest knowing all the rules, and then throwing them out the window. Like the philosopher Ludwig Wittgenstein wrote of philosophy, it’s a ladder that you climb and then throw away when you get to the top.

Kathryn has some great basics. They aren’t even “game”. Just simple dating etiquette (its not a rule that you can’t eat with your mouth open, but no one would want to be with you after that). Jada has some great advice too.

First impressions and casual dating is like an job interview. There are certain ways to act in a job interview, its not necessarily you but you do it to get the job, then you show the more complete you. Same with dating.

Well said, Chaco and Kathryn. As for the case of the Smug Engaged Girl, I guess there are always exceptions to the “rule”

Wow, a Wittgenstein quote. That’s a FDDC first.

I agree wholeheartedly with Chaco on the “go for it” and Smug Married on the “knowing the rules and throwing them out the window.” This whole dating scene is so ridiculous. Lets just try honesty people…how is the “game” fun? Maybe at 27, I am too old for it already but as I see it:

If you like someone-show it. Dont be some slobbering idiot and profess your love on the first date but CALL and ask her out….you should know off the bat if someone is into you back and if they arent then peace yourself out and if you arent sure then try again…there are plenty of girls and (Gd I pray) guys that just want to either meet and have a fling or meet and find love. Be honest, up front and if they cant handle it…they arent worth your time…The game never is. Unless you are like 12.

Do you guys really try not to call too much in the beginning to look cool? The guys I’ve liked the most are the ones that call all the time (the ones I liked) and then I get used to them around and don’t have room for other dudes! She’s either going to like you or she doesn’t.

I used to play games but no more.. I’m even calling guys I’m (kind - of) dating once a week or so to hang out/meet up with friends (gasp!)- what do you guys think of that? Too much?

OK- re- reading my last post I realize how pathetically I have been victimized by books like “The Rules”….but seriously- do yah think it’s too much to invite them out once in a while or no? :) Ugh- brainwashing!!!

well considering that this is a dating web site, most of the readers are probably single, so we (myself included) are probably not the best people to be giving advice. (if your goal is a long-term relationship.) In my experience, if I come on too strong w/ a guy, and if I’m too over-eager, than he freaks out and thinks I want to get really serious, etc. etc. When I have been much more laid-back about things, then they are usually pursuing me hardcore, and bringing up “where do we stand” and “are you interested in me because I really like you” talks. I’m not really advocating one approach over the other, because as of now neither has resulted in me meeting the right guy, but I think that the most important thing is to have fun with dating and let things work out naturally. Maybe if we don’t force things, than maybe things will just work out how they are supposed to. As my married friends tell me, when you meet the right one, you’ll just know.

Pinky, no, it’s perfectly ok to call and ask a man out. If a man devalues you because of that, he is an idiot. Maybe it’s a confidence thing with those guys, because if a girl chases me, I just assume she has sound judgement and knows a great guy when she sees one. Hmm, guess that means I value her more!

The idea of playing the player is important for both sexes because both do throw game around. However, the more you play, and hopefully develop an honest enough approach, the better you will get at spotting what game you like and don’t. I think a person’s game is usually indicative of what that person will be like to date so if the game is not to your liking that’s a good early indicator that he or she may not be worth your time.

Chaco- thank you! I love that.. but the question remains- why are you not calling her enough that she feel she need to call you? If you like her would you let time go by without a call? Like several days or a week if you are really busy? I’m talking about beginning stages (after, say, 3/4 dates) Hmm….see why I start having doubts!!

Pinky, even if I am digging a girl, I still won’t call too often early on. I’ll try to see her once a week for a few weeks, then increase to 2x per week. After 6-8 weeks, then maybe 3x per week. During the time when I am only seeing her 1x per week, I’ll call one other time that week, mostly to set up the next date. However, I don’t think a girl would ever feel like I am “not calling enough” such that she would want to call me (unless she really has a thing for the phone). Therefore, I would not read into a guy not calling for a few days early on in the relationship. But going a whole week without contact, either phone, text, or email, I think you could then wonder if he was that into you or not. He could be signaling that he is only looking to keep things casual with you (i.e., sexual only), or that he isn’t that interested in progressing things further on any level.

I would like to offer a corollary:
Troubled Dater: “Why is it that the guys(girls) I’m interested in take forever to call but the ones I’m not interested in won’t go away?!”
Observant friend: “But aren’t Mr. McDreamy and Captain Creepy both calling/taking you out about once a week?”
Toubled Dater: “…maybe…”

If you’re super-hot for the person, you’re going to want to hear from him/her as often as possible. When you don’t, you will enter the Bermuda Triangle of media hell–checking your cell, refreshing your email, calling into your machine…lather, rinse, repeat. You’re so giddy that this god/goddess is into and want to verify that fact frequently with some sort of contact. However, if you’re “just not that into” him/her, then a once per week phone call may seem like sooo much pressure.

Play it safe and keep the contact minimal at first. If she’s into you, you’ll have her working herself into a frenzy wondering when you’re going to call. If she’s not, then at least you’re keeping yourself out of the pshcyo-stalker creep category. If she calls you, that is a HUGE sign that she’s into you (most of us have been either conditioned by the Rules not to call or have enough guys calling us that we don’t need to call them) and you should take that as a sign to up the frequency of contact if you’re interested in seeing more of her.

Zoo sex….

Zoo sex….

Norco bikes….

Drugs detected on drug test norco. Norco bank robbery. Get norco by paying consultation fee. Norco ca fire. Norco bank robbery documentary. Norco homes for sale. Norco louisiana….