First Date DC

“but seriously, when should i call?”



Stresscase

He’s Just Not That Into Me…Or Is He? writes,

I started dating this WONDERFUL guy a couple of months ago. For the first month
or so we were on the same page, but now I’m afraid that either (A) he’s losing interest, or (B) I let myself start to like him too much and am now obsessing for no good reason. Here’s a quick run-down:

*** FIRST 6 WEEKS ***
After our first date, we saw each other pretty intensely. We knew his job was sending him overseas for a month soon, so we saw each other about 11 of the next 14 days. We both even called into work sick one day just to have more time to spend together. He introduced me to all his friends and would say to them how much he liked me in front of them. He would send me emails from work saying he couldn’t seem to get me off his mind. I’d tell him I was suffering from the same ailment, so he’d drive across town to meet me for lunch. We spent the night at each other’s place several times. No sex; just quality time. (In fact, he didn’t even make a move which I took as a sign of respect.) He even gave me foot massages before work! This isn’t usually how I start things off, but it just sort of happened and it felt wonderful.

Overall, I found him to be the most refreshing guy I had met in a long time. I remarked to my friends how nice it was to date a guy who didn’t keep me guessing how he felt about me. The only 2 things that might have been red flags were: (1) He mentioned that his friends call him a ’serial monogomist’ because he was always in a relationship, but that for the first time in his life, he was in “dating” mode. It’s been 2 years since his last relationship; (2) He mentioned having just called things off with another woman he had been seeing. I asked if he had any other people he was seeing. His response was “Yes, but I’m working on bringing that to a resolution too” (which I took to mean closure).

The third wild card is that his job requires him to travel A LOT. Every other month, he has to go overseas for 3-4 weeks. He comes home for 2-4 week intervals in between. His first trip occured around week 3 of our dating, and he was gone for a month. That meant no face-to-face time obviously, but he called every other day so I felt pretty comfortable that things were looking good despite the distance.

*** THE RETURN ***
Once he came back from his first trip though, thing seemed a little different - certainly less intense. To be fair, he only had one week at home before heading overseas again so things were pretty hectic for him. During that week, we went to dinner twice and hung out a his place one night. Seeing someone three times in a week probably sounds normal, right? Thing is, I couldn’t help but feel like he was being a little bit distant. Sure, we hung out but it kinda felt like our plans were always tentative and only came together at the last minute. Whereas before he seemed to wanna squeeze in as much time with me as possible, this time he seemed to want quite a bit of time on his own.

Maybe he was just being normal for a guy who only has one week in country before spending another month overseas, but given its stark contrast with the voracity with which we were spending time together our first two weeks, I felt like something had “happened” to make him less interested.

During that last night that he was in town, I remarked that he seemed a little different and asked him if I had done anything to make him mad or put him off. He seemed confused by my question and said that it had just been a very busy week for him. My response was, “Yea, I know you’ve been busy, but you also seem a bit distant.” He didn’t really respond to that, except to say that he wished he could come up with something funny to say that would lighten the mood. We changed the subject.

TO BE CONTINUED ?????????

He’s now overseas for another month, and unfortunately, he’s in a country from which he can’t make phone calls this time. He has been there about 2 weeks, and while he does respond to my emails, he never really initiates contact (again - stark contrast to all the overseas phone calls initiated by him during his first trip). I’m thinking I should stop emailing him for a while to see if he takes any initiative; somehow I think it’ll give me a more accurate guage of his interest. Of course, I hate feeling like I have to calculate my moves now, as not having to do that is what I found so refreshing about him in the first place.

I’m not sure if he’s really pulling away, or if I’m just overanalyzing what would be a normal dating relationship (albeit complicated by periods of distance). I feel like we started out on Cloud 9 together but that he shifted down to Cloud 5 without really telling me. I’m kind of starting to obsess about it. That’s not really me, and I know it’s not really healthy. But I also know that I wouldn’t have let myself get to this point if I hadn’t initially gotten signals from him that he was as intensely into me as I still am into him.

He’ll be back in 2 weeks, but I’m not really sure I’m going to hear from him when he gets back. Am I overanalyzing or should I be preparing myself to move on? I’ve gone out with a couple of other guys - just to have something else to think about - but I don’t think it’s working because I still think about him all the time. God, I hate when guys leave a woman guessing!!!

Home Improvement Ninja says,

“now I’m afraid that either (A) he’s losing interest, or (B) I let myself start to like him too much and am now obsessing for no good reason”

Well, you seem to think you’re question is an “exclusive disjunction.” As if the answer to your question couldn’t be both that he is becoming not interested AND you are obsessing too much and overly attached. But rather than wax on about Formal Logic, I’ll answer your dating question.

Why I think you’re overly attached and obsessing too much:

a) You’ve only been dating this guy for two months and during one of those months he wasn’t even in the country.

b) you haven’t even had sex yet. (but he gave you a foot massage? not even going there) but you’re worried enough to write to Kathryn about it.

c) you said you saw each other “11 of those 14 days.” Why are you counting? Don’t you think that’s mildly obsessive?

Why I think he is losing interest:

a) his “other relationship” is either giving him drama about breaking up, or he is getting more serious about her, which affects the way he sees you.

b) your desperation may be freaking him out.

Plotting your dates out on an Excel Spreadsheet isn’t helping you, girlie. Why don’t you stop overanalyzing the situation and take things as you would in a less-intense relationship? The Tao Te Ching tells us that

For those who practice not-doing,
everything will fall into place.

I think your desperation/insecurity is very off-putting. I was put off by it, and I’m only reading your letter. I imagine that he is getting putt off by it because he has to deal with your insecurities in person. Insecurity is more repellent than cheap perfume so your obsession about the relationship fading out may turn it into a self-fulfilling prophecy.

I think moderation is the key, The Great Book tells us that:

He who stands on his tip toes, does not stand firm,
He who takes the longest stride, does not walk fastest.

If this downtime isn’t a result of drama from the other girl he’s dating (and that’s a pretty big “IF”) Maybe this is your cue to take it a little slower and less seriously. I think a relationship that progresses slowly is better than one with fireworks that fizzles out quickly. A relationship is like a dance. If he is now doing the tango, you should stop waltzing. Or better yet, why don’t you listen to the music and figure out which one of you is off beat. Wow, that metaphor smells like fromunda cheese.

And speaking of bad metaphors…Getting intense feelings early on is risky. On Wall Street, if someone takes a risky position, they usually protect themselves by hedging that position, and adjusting the hedge as the market moves against them. This “dynamic delta hedging” works as well in assessing relationships as well as delta hedging Latin American equity options. Take it slowly and open up if you feel it’s warranted and hold your cards closer to your vest if you feel the relationship is going the other way. Also, never go short on Chilean bonds. Trust me on that.

And rather than guess about what he meant by “bringing that to a resolution” why don’t you just say “Huh? Resolution? WTF are you talking about?”

Kathryn says,

If he’s leaving you guessing, he’s not interested. Guys who like you stay in touch. They don’t make you freak out all the time. It’s really that easy.

“Am I overanalyzing or should I be preparing myself to move on?” Prepare yourself to move on. Keep dating other guys. And before you know it, you’ll think about him less and less. Especially once you find one who doesn’t leave you guessing.

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16 Comments »

You have had 10+ dates and he hasn’t even tried to have sex with you? That’s the biggest red flag of all. I think it’s possible he is sleeping with someone else. Or he has some uptightness issues. Or he is about to announce to the world that he is gay. But whatever the issue, it’s not normal for a guy to have that many dates and not even try for sex. If I had to guess I’d say it’s #1, that he is sleeping with someone else. On your next date, try initiating some hotter and heavier action and see how he responds.

Comment by Chaco on 09/25/06.



Confuscious say: “To get from cloud 5 to cloud 9, one must first visit cloud 69″

Comment by cosmic shambles on 09/25/06.



Some guys take their time. I see nothing wrong with a few sleepovers or waiting until you’ve been dating for a month or so before having sex. What can you do that he can’t do as well or better with some oil and a high speed internet connection? Taking his time could mean that he values the intimacy as well as the sex.

Now, he’s just blowing through town between trips. His mind is gonna be constantly clicking about what has to be done before he can leave again. It’s gonna take a bit more of a distraction than a foot rub to clear all that out of his head. He was distant and distracted. Nothing to do with you. Don’t worry about it.
That, or he’s thinking about how far he should take things with you while he hasn’t shaken off his other relationships yet. Being a serial monogomist he’s going to want to make sure you’re the only woman before he has sex with you.

Now he’s in another country. He has certain things that have to be accomplished before he comes back. We have the luxury of having the time to post to FDDC while at work. It’s a safe bet that he doesn’t.

Don’t worry about it. His behavior will probably be different when he’s in town for a longer rest.

Or I’m completely wrong, he has a wife and kids in some other city, and he travels back and forth keeping a wife there and a girlfriend here. Happens on TV all the time.

Comment by Ibid on 09/25/06.



Or I’m completely wrong, he has a wife and kids in some other city, and he travels back and forth keeping a wife there and a girlfriend here. Happens on TV all the time.

Ibid - happens in my apartment complex all the time, LOL.

Comment by toomuchcoffeelady on 09/25/06.



I could not read that.

FDCC: Please screen the questions, or edit them so they’re more readable. I have no difficulty reading long questions, but long poorly written questions are another matter.

Comment by Anonymous on 09/25/06.



I’m thinking that he’s just not that into you. I’m sorry, but from my dating experience, when guys are interested, they’ll make the effort.

Case in point: My boyfriend of 1 1/2 years. The night we met, we exchanged phone numbers. I heard from him shortly thereafter, despite the fact that he came down with a raging cold. Even though he wasn’t feeling his best, he still made a date with me (albeit for when he was feeling better.)

Or.. maybe what Chaco says is correct. Maybe he’s bummed by the lack of booty. I don’t know…

Comment by The BLS on 09/25/06.



I agree about the sex thing. I mean 10 dates?! When a guy says he just wants to “cuddle” or whatever, I don’t think he’s that interested. I think by date 3 he’d have been trying to get into your pants if he was really into you.

Something else to consider…did you ever stop to think that he probably LIKES travelling so much for the very reason that it means he doesn’t have anyone or anything to tie him down? I know he travels for work, but I get the impression that many people who sign on for jobs requiring that much travel a.)knew that much travel was going to be the case and b.) quite like that component of it. He knows that whenever things start to get too serious/complicated, a trip is probably just right around the corner.

So you’re wondering if he’s either losing interest or you’re obsessing too much. The way I see it, it is not an either/or situation. They are connected. Subconsciously, at the very least, he’s picked up on your uneasiness, your phishing for affirmation of “where we stand” and stuff. That is triggering his flight mode, hence…he is losing interest. My suggestion to you? Stop being the one to initiate contact. If he doesn’t contact you on the behalf of his own free will, you have your answer. But from where I stand, it ain’t looking too good. Save face and end it first.

Comment by Quinn on 09/25/06.



The number of female posters y’all have had lately who go on double-digit numbers of dates with guys over multiple months without having sex are making me feel like a total slut. I mean, it requires concerted effort on my part to make it to the socially sanctioned third date before sex.

Comment by flippantangel on 09/25/06.



reaching double digit dates w/o having sex is ridiculous..

Comment by Anonymous on 09/25/06.



No, it is not ridiculous if someone truly doesn’t feel comfortable with having sex at that point, whether it be date #2 or date #20. It is ridiculous to adhere to some dumb rule because you fear falling prey to the capricious social construct of being a “slut” or “manwhore.”

Comment by Quinn on 09/25/06.



Agreed with flippantangel and quinn. The 3 date rule before sex is just arbitrary and meaningless.

Comment by nabeel on 09/25/06.



Here’s a female perspective for you: you are over-obsessing and being the “typical woman” men avoid like the plague. STOP IT!!! Why do women constantly put themselves in this position? Probably because men are assholes and leave women with no choice. But women around the world, UNITE! If this is the game, learn how to play. You blow that mother f-er off. If he comes back to you, still play it cool (because he could be the type that just thrives on the chase). Basically, unless the words “I want to be in an exclusive relationship with you” comes out of his mouth, you go do your own thing, paying him no mind.

Comment by anon on 09/26/06.



Take it a step further, anon. Until the woman has an engagement/wedding ring on her finger, she can do whatever the hell she wants.

Comment by Quinn on 09/26/06.



In my experience, the guys who don’t try anything out of being a gentleman and taking it slow ended up having other sources of sex.

Comment by Madonna on 09/27/06.



My Jacket Theory fits this situation. He moved fast in the beginning to “try you on”, then he pulled away once you didn’t really fit his life. He may just not like you enough to date you long distance. But needy is never good.

Comment by Pagan Marbury on 09/27/06.



I know of someone who sounds very similar to this guy. He is all talk and no walking the walk. Forget him. I doubt he cares much about your obsessing or attachment. The person who is bothered most by that is yourself, and you should be because he’s not worth it. He loved the attention you gave him, in fact he fed and nutured it, and enjoyed the intense fantasy of whatever game he was playing, but he has gotten bored by this point. Maybe probably has a woman or two elsewhere and that is why he did not have sex with you (because if you don’t have sex, “it’s not cheating). Or he is just not interested in a serious, genuine relationship with anyone right now. Maybe no one is good enough for him. Also, I doubt he introduced you to “all” his friends. He probably has separate sets of friends and a compartmentalized, messed up life that you do not need to get involved in. Move on.

Comment by djflowerz on 09/27/06.



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